Buying a new O2 sensor, or an eliminator?

[Guest lassho]

Hi all

I seem to have destroyed the o2 sensor on my bike when replacing the exhaust. The FI light gives twp long blink and 3 short blinks. According to my manual this means the o2 sensor is faulty.

I cant find a new o2 sensor anywhere but an eliminator I found on the net relativly cheap. Anyone know if there is any disadvantage to running without the sensor?

Also if someone could point me in the direction of somewhere I could buy a new sensor that would be great.

Thanks

[Guest standish honda]

If you are running a standard exhaust and not using a power commander it would be better replacing the sensor and playing safe, if you have an aftermarket exhaust and power commander then use an O2 eliminator. Another solution if you cannot find a sensor and want a cheaper fix than an O2 eliminator would be to link out the sensor connections on the wiring loom with a resistor (think 330 ohm). Some people report side effects when they fit an eliminator with a standard exhaust, some say it clears flat spots in the lower ranges but others say they get power surges due to the ECU not getting a true signal back from the sensor. I would be suprised if David Silver cannot supply a new sensor though.

[Guest lassho]

Ok, thanks. I sent a mail to David Silver.

I have a Akra 4-1 system mounted. The engin runs fine without the sensor, but the FI lamp blinks of course.

I will wait to descide what to de. If the sensor is expensive, I will go for the eliminator.

Thanks again.

[plastic_orange 214]

Eliminator is around ?15 I think - I use one and bike runs fine.

Pete

[Guest standish honda]

Map Sensor is what controls the fuel air mixture mostly, but it hands off to the O2 sensors when in open loop during those steady throttle sessions then it goes very lean into stoichometric, it think its 14 parts air 1 part fuel. Map sensor measures the manifold vacuum pressure which is what controls the fuel mix when tied with the throttle postion sensor - its a three dimensional map tp sensor vs map sensor air temp sensor in the airbox - it is when one of these variables is held constant that the O2 sensors is used, TP constant input for so many seconds loops in the o2 sensors.

It is an excorize in Boyle's law

PV=C

and adjusting for temperature

V=CT

The computer needs to know the volume of air at what pressure and temperature in the cyclinder to inject the right amount of fuel based on the throttle input at the time of the intake stroke.

It reads temperature from the temperature sensor and reads pressure with the map sensor, and then calculates the amount fuel - it is not 100% correct so there is not always an effiecient burn so when the throttle postion is held constant it can read the O2 sensor reading and inject stochometric fuel loads. Its of course more complicated than I explain but basically thats the idea.

And thats it in a nutshell. Oh not my work it was cut and pasted but the theory is sound enough, and explains how it all fits together.

[Guest djs]

Who are you, and what have you done with the real Standish?

[Guest standish honda]

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THAT IS ALL WE CAN TELL YOU AT THIS STAGE EARTHLING

[Guest djs]

That's it. Your obviously either spending too much time on wiki or are from one of those far off places that may or may not exsist. Like Penge.

[Guest standish honda]

Nay my friend i am from Hovis land

[Guest Gean]

Eish.......Standish........about a year ago I asked the question what would happen if you swopped the X's map sensor for a Blackbird one. You seems to have a moment of brilliance.........any ideas maybe ??

In English please.........dont understand crazy that well :toothy12:!!

Regards

[Guest raeman]

If the fi lamp keeps blinking,why not just put some black tape over it? If the bikes running fine with the lamp flashing,i would just leave it...easy fix!! :laugh:

[Guest standish honda]

Gean, basically all you are doing by fitting an O2 eliminator is fitting a fixed resistance across the sensor connections to fool the ECU into thinking that the mixture is ok. It appears to me that various people have used a resistance of 330 ohms, go to Radio shack or somewhere comparable that sells electronic components and try shorting out the connections (cost you a few buttons). Dont see why the Bigbird sensor wont do the trick though if you have one. If you have an ohm meter try measuring the resistance of both sensors and comparing. The FI light should only flash as long as the sensing cables have no resistance across them (indicating sensor failure). If all else fails jab it with a big stick until it squeels.interestingly the way the GSXR1000 before last was unlocked was with a resistor of value of less than ?1.00.

[Guest standish honda]

just been having a read on Fireblade.org, reported on there that fitting an 02 eliminator can cost between 20-30% poorer fuel consumption, same guy claims it can be regained with a Power Commander. summat to ponder on? Most of the bigbird forums don't mention the fitting of an eliminator, did come across a few threads for turbo'd birds though.

[Guest Gean]

Wasnt talking about the 02 eliminator though, asking about the MAP SENSOR and what would happen if you swopped it with a blackbird one ??

" If all else fails jab it with a big stick until it squeels " I like this one, will be using it on a customer today !!

Regards

[Guest standish honda]

oh sorry i was listening honestly, don't let that vacant expression fool you (it's a tele sales technique iam developing),why would you want to swap the map sensor with a blackbird one? The map sensor is more critical than the O2 sensor to the overall running of the thing. The only thing i can sugets is get hold of the two parts microfiches and compare part numbers for X & Bird.

[Guest Gean]

Was just wondering if the mapping on the Blackbird wasnt better since it was done for longer gear ratios ??

I'am in the performance industry and like you said " GSXR1000 before last was unlocked with a resistor of value of less than ?1.00." could it be the " holy grail " for the X ??

Just a conspiracy theory I have...........

[Guest standish honda]

conspiracy is the root of paranoia my friend, let me know what happens when you do it, we can use your bike as a work in progress (guinea pig) if yours blows up we could constue it as progression. Think better mods could be acheived by getting a better cooler source of air through the intakes , and increasing the flow out of the block. Like wayne found with his mod on the ignition, it is a small gain but put them all together and they add up. The worry is that anything too major like re-camming and altering valves may alter the whole charecteristics of the bike ie, more hp with a negligable torque increase, bottom line is it is still a naked bike i suppose.

[Guest G1bbo]

Dont understand all this eliminator talk, are you talking about what to do if you damage the sensor? and can you fit an exhaust for an fi 'bird and mount the x's sensor?

[fast_eddy 713]

It's if you mount a zorst without the hole for the sensor.

[x11r 386]

I had My X dyno'd with the O2 sensor and then with an eliminator on back to back runs , and the fueling was virtualy the same on both runs as the O2 sensor is only working at low throttle positions and revs.

[wayne 427]

Any changes from last time John ?

[x11r 386]

No Just 144.3 rwhp with if I remember corectly 89llbft torque.

Thats running 17th front and 40th rear sprockets , I think the fireblade wheel being 7kg lighter may have given it 1hp !

Edited February 1, 2012 by x11r

[wayne 427]

Like that torque figure

[Kenko 335]

John, what have you done to your engine to get those figures?

[x11r 386]

Nothing Ken thats just with full Acro and a K & N